Leaking Oil (I want to cry).

[OptimusPrimeSr]

>>1 MONTH AGO<< I'm sick as a dog and its 40degrees and raining. I'm going to visit my parents soon and need to get my oil changed before the trip...so I bite the bullet and take her in to the place I used to go to before I got into maintaining my own car (Express Oil).

>>1 WEEK AGO<< I'm getting ready to go to the store and its drizzling outside. I notice the dry spots under all the cars...all the cars except mine. Surely...please...no. I back my car up and touch the spot...sure enough, its oil. I check the stick, and I'm down about 2 quarts.

I look under the car and notice a drop of oil about to fall off the drain bolt and think...well maybe its not that bad...maybe a loose drain bolt. So I jackstand the frontend to examine the problem more closely, and notice the motherfkers used an aluminum washer on the oil pan drain plug. ARGGGGG! So I take the wife's car, head to autozone, and grab a new plug w/ a proper washer and some more oil and replace both.

>>YESTERDAY<< I head out for another errand and notice another wet spot under my car. Hoping its an old stain or something, I back up my car, touch the ground, and yes, its...anyone ... anyone... anyone...OIL!#(*&$.

I check the dip stick and note that I'm maybe half a quart HIGH...wtf, I measured that shit 4-5 times after replacing the drain plug only a week ago and it was only at the second hole in on the stick. SHIT.

-----------------------
I'm probably not going to be able to get up under the car until tomorrow or the next day, but here's what I'm thinking...

jack it up, drain 1/2 a quart of oil, wipe everything down to the best of my ability, let it run and try to find the leak.

- How likely am I looking at something other than the drain plug or oil pan gasket?
- Could I have really messed it up by driving around for a week with the oil level half a quart high?


The engine essentially only has about 15k miles on it...I'll have to dig up the paper work to find out what was replaced with brand new and what was simply over-hauled.

[Rendon LX-i]

your Rings can take a shit if your to high but i done that couple times didnt hurt anything. I would take Quart out then put your drain plug in. Get some dye to see if its your oil pan gasket. And dont dont do the mistake i did by not torqueing the pan bolts. 10 ft pounds.

[OptimusPrimeSr]

Get some dye to see if its your oil pan gasket

can you please elaborate on this?




Update: I'm taking the day off tomorrow from work to address this issue. please proceed to pelt me with methods for determining the source of the leaking oil.

[cubert]

can you please elaborate on this?




Update: I'm taking the day off tomorrow from work to address this issue. please proceed to pelt me with methods for determining the source of the leaking oil.

There is a dye you can add to you oil that makes it react to a blacklight, so you can see where the leak is coming from.

Another technique is to dry all the oil up, and buy a can of spray on foot powder. Spray around where you think it is leaking from, and when the oil leaks it will go through the powder, leading you to the source.

[2ndGenGuy]

I thought you were supposed to use an aluminum washer on the drain plug?

[OptimusPrimeSr]

There is a dye you can add to you oil that makes it react to a blacklight, so you can see where the leak is coming from.

Another technique is to dry all the oil up, and buy a can of spray on foot powder. Spray around where you think it is leaking from, and when the oil leaks it will go through the powder, leading you to the source.

will look into this...thanks.

[OptimusPrimeSr]

I thought you were supposed to use an aluminum washer on the drain plug?

never heard of that, nor have I ever used one.


edit: after quick googling, you are correct. however, some recommend going with other materials to avoid prematurely wearing out the threads due to the excessive torque necessary to get a tight seal.

maybe my threads are fucked and I need a new oil pan...

[Oldblueaccord]

The Honda washer for the oil drain plug is aluminium. its pretty soft and good for a few uses before it needs replacing.


wp

[anubix]

lol
you checked your oil in your drive way.

Is your driveway uphill? if so, that would explain why it seemed lower than it was. (i'm not saying you weren't leaking, but probably not as bad as you thought)
When you checked the second time, were you in the same spot? or a different one? or were u in the same spot pointed downhill, which would also give a different reading reading?

YOU GOTS TO DO IT ON A LEVEL SURFACE, foundation cement @ gas stations is usually level, especially around the in ground tanks. thats where I does it if I can't get my car into my garage, which also obviously has a level floor.

[OptimusPrimeSr]

lol
you checked your oil in your drive way.

Is your driveway uphill? if so, that would explain why it seemed lower than it was. (i'm not saying you weren't leaking, but probably not as bad as you thought)
When you checked the second time, were you in the same spot? or a different one? or were u in the same spot pointed downhill, which would also give a different reading reading?

YOU GOTS TO DO IT ON A LEVEL SURFACE, foundation cement @ gas stations is usually level, especially around the in ground tanks. thats where I does it if I can't get my car into my garage, which also obviously has a level floor.

I live in a small townhouse cluster...not a typical driveway and pretty much flat. I will admit, I was checking the oil level while the car was jacked up. Will make a note in the future...ty.

I would kill for a garage

[OptimusPrimeSr]

well I took the day off from work....whooooooo hoooooooo

today's agenda...
1. finish coffee
2. replace pump seal on leaking dishwasher.
3. more coffee, maybe some breakfast
4. drain oil to correct level, lowering front end to check
5. say prayers that oil is leaking from somewhere that's easily fixable
6. remember I don't believe in god and snap out of it
7. drink another cup of coffee
8. find source of oil leak (will use dye if necessary)

[cubert]

let us know how it goes

[OptimusPrimeSr]

well it didn't go so well.

1. driver and passenger outer boots are cracked...looks recent since there's still a good amount of grease packed up in the boot.
<sorry no pics...I'm sure everyone can imagine what it looks like from personal experience>

2. discovered an anti-freeze leak somewhere in the back/bottom area of the carb.


close up - top of this image is the wall separating the cabin from engine bay


3. couldn't pinpoint the oil leak. I have 2 or 3 suspected sources, but can't pin point it.

suspect 1 - seems like the oil could easily be coming from the driver side of the engine...camshaft seal?...hopefully not the block.


suspect 2 - after wiping down, then firing up the car, I noticed what appeared to be a drip line coming from the metal pipe attached to the oil pan. seems possible that the hose has a hole, maybe a leak from the oil pan gasket.



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So here's the deal, I'm taking my car in to a shop I trust (Far East Motor Works for those in ATL). I've done boots before, and I'd just rather pay for that to be taken care of. And since they are doing that, I might as well get an estimate on the new AF leak (which can probably be resolved by replacing a few tubes) and the persisting Oil leak (which btw is much much slower than I originally though).


EDIT: oh yeah, and the replacement seal kit for the dishwasher pump/motor resolved that issue, so I'm considering myself up about $200 for the day...makes the car trouble a little easier to swallow.

[2oodoor]

good day so far !!
yep those oil leaks are not easy to deal with in a driveway, cant get to them good even with a floor jack

[OptimusPrimeSr]

roodoo, long time bro...hope things are well.

good day so far !!
yep those oil leaks are not easy to deal with in a driveway, cant get to them good even with a floor jack

no doubt. top 10 purchases after submitting a winning lotto ticket would include ample garage space with a car lift.

[LX-incredible]

suspect 1 - seems like the oil could easily be coming from the driver side of the engine...camshaft seal?...hopefully not the block.

Cam seal, crank seal, or oil pump. Crank and cam seals can be easily replaced with an inexpensive seal puller, adequately sized PVC pipe fittings, and a hammer to drive them. Oil pump is easy as well. You'll need to remove the cover and timing belt to get a good idea which it is...

suspect 2 - after wiping down, then firing up the car, I noticed what appeared to be a drip line coming from the metal pipe attached to the oil pan. seems possible that the hose has a hole, maybe a leak from the oil pan gasket.

Could be that or the tube that the pcv valve goes into, o-ring that seals the breather box to block, or the dried up grommet at the top of the box. The oil filter housing to block seal may be leaking as well. If you plan on removing that box, the valve, or any of the tubes, make sure you have all the rubber to replace what you touch. That crap will shatter like high-temp plastic if it hasn't been replaced.

Your coolant leak looks to be coming from above...

[2oodoor]

roodoo, long time bro...hope things are well.



no doubt. top 10 purchases after submitting a winning lotto ticket would include ample garage space with a car lift.

mine would be going to the barret jackson auto auction and pick up one or five of those GM cars they are releasing from the GM collection. I watched it briefly this weekend and there was a brand spanking new olds W-30 442 72 model... super super sweet car
One of 100 special 69 camaros with a vette 427 engine... drewl

[Dr_Snooz]

Cam seal, crank seal, or oil pump. Crank and cam seals can be easily replaced with an inexpensive seal puller, adequately sized PVC pipe fittings, and a hammer to drive them.

Just use a medium to small slotted screwdriver to pull the old seal. Jam it through and pry it out. Use a socket (24 mm?) to drive the cam seal and use the old crank seal to drive the new crank seal. Just place the old seal over the new one, face to face, and hammer lightly around the perimeter until it is home. I did that for my rear main seal because I couldn't find anything big enough to drive it. It works amazingly well.

[LX-incredible]

I did that for my rear main seal because I couldn't find anything big enough to drive it. It works amazingly well.

I've done it that way, but an assortment of 3" sewer fittings works better.

[OptimusPrimeSr]

just spoke with the mechanic.
- main oil leak is coming from the power steering pump seal ($90)
- much smaller oil leak coming from the oil-pan gasket ($180).
- AF is leaking from a cracked hose ($65).
- driver's side axle replacement ($225)
- passenger side boot replacement ($160)
- leak coming from the master cylinder ($395)

I told them to fix everything with the exception of the master cylinder and the oil pan gasket. I'm going to do those myself if necessary.

[2oodoor]

Oh man that master cyl must be gold plated, you could recondition the whole brake system for less than that.

[OptimusPrimeSr]

Oh man that master cyl must be gold plated, you could recondition the whole brake system for less than that.

lol. should have specified those numbers include both parts and labor.

once I get my car back tomorrow, I'm going to focus on the master cylinder. How does one just go bad?

[carotman]

I assume that these prices are parts AND labor?

[OptimusPrimeSr]

I assume that these prices are parts AND labor?

yeah parts and labor.



UPDATE
got the car back on Friday. Drove it probably only about 20 miles this weekend and go up underneath it today to see that I still have oil leaking ...and I just don't think its *all* coming from the oil pan...even with wind, it looks to be too high for that to be the only source.

I'm planning ordering some parts...valve cover gasket, oil pump seal, front crank seal, and front cam seal since the oil is really only on that side.

Once those parts arrive, I'm going to take the valve and timing covers off to get a good luck at the potential sources of oil leakage (other than the oil pan gasket -- that will be last).

If I can definitely narrow it down to a single source, then I'll replace that one only...however, if I can't tell, I'm doing them all. I'm putting 70% chances on it being the oil pump (after spending a little time researching). Hoping the crankshaft seal looks clean since I'm a little worried about getting the crankshaft pulley off.


Anything else I should take care of while I'm all up in it?
Is it necessary to detach AC and PS and move them aside?
Oh, also doing the master cylinder...fuck it, why not?


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I gotta say, I'm a little PO'd that I'm having oil leaking. I bought the car 1.5 years ago with a rebuilt engine...could I have just done a really shitty job breaking it in?

[russiankid]

Do the timing belt while you're at it. It would be kind of dumb to do all of that work and not change the belt and tensioner.