Innovative mount thread - REFUNDS

[ghettogeddy]

This is the reply we gotafter i called

this is tommy fiance a few of you have called looking for tommy he is not here he been gone for over a month and he wont be back for a few more month's do to a family problem with his ex's new husband and tommy kids all i can say is tempers were lost and now he is paying the price for it he is not trying to rip anyone off on here where he at his hands are tied and i only get to talk to him once a month so as soon as he get's back i am sure everything will get back on track this group buy was his thing so i have no idea whats going on with it but i will ask him next time he calls me. I am sorry if this has inconvenience anyone and i am sorry i did not let anyone know on here but ive been busy working and taking care of my kids it is hard when it's just one.t.s.

a day or 2 later

i was willing to help and work with you guys on this until i hear from tommy and get the answer's your looking for now you guys have fucked that up by putting my name and address on the internet for every sicko to see and put my family in danger. Until my name and address is totally removed from public vewing i will not help or talk to any of you. Ps thanks for posting my number i love getting crank call's every two minutes all night long

what do you expect her to do

[LX-incredible]

what do you expect her to do

Issue refunds from her account.

[stat1K]

yep it's as simple as a button click... so if she "doesn't" know who and what to pay, it's as simple as going back 60-90 days and seeing a lot of 305's show up... i'm sure there are even comments that say group buy or 3geez.com...

[ghettogeddy]

thats your opinion
mine is if i was in tommys "shoes"
i wouldn't want my gf or wife or anyone to fuck with it till i got back

and to be honest put your self in his shoes "you have to go with the fact that he might be in jail on this one"

if all you had was one phone call a month would this be the most important thing during that phone call " less then a 30 min call i believe"

doubtful

[nswst8]

She had already stated that she was going to discuss this with Tommy when she got to talk to him. I don't believe she will make a move without involving Tommy. (I don't blame her).

['A20A3']

yeah im with homie on this. if you guys are so comfortable waiting, buy my spot from me. i want my money back. OR. COMMUNICATION!

but yes, if you have the phone #, please please please PM it to me.

i'm going to call and very politely ask what is going on, even if i have to leave a message with my phone number, its okay. because if my call is never returned, i know where they stand. it will be clear.

again, THEIR problems, are not MY problems, therefore, they shouldnt be causing ME problems.

i want what is rightfully MINE, and if you guys dont like it, i dont really think i could care any less about it. this is a ridiculous situation. all any of us want is communication from these people, and we have nothing. they even covered their tracks by making it next to impossible to reach them. if that doesnt smell like bullshit, i dont know what does.

['A20A3']

"i was willing to help and work with you guys on this until i hear from tommy and get the answer's your looking for now you guys have fucked that up by putting my name and address on the internet for every sicko to see and put my family in danger. Until my name and address is totally removed from public vewing i will not help or talk to any of you. Ps thanks for posting my number i love getting crank call's every two minutes all night long"



well the info is gone, have we heard a response...? hmmmmmmmmmmmm


and PS every person, everyday, regardless of how many damn kids they have, has AT LEAST 5 MINUTES, to communicate with people. especially when the people are shareholders in a group buy that is looking like a ripoff. if they really gave a fuck about any of us and what position WE are in, then they would do something about it.

[stat1K]

agreed harvey.

I say call innovative and talk to tim and explain to him the situation to see what was ever ironed out by "tommy." See if any of the details match what was said in the thread. I've tried to email Tim but he's a busy guy and I only get responses about 2 weeks after I send them. So I think calling would serve much better.

[nswst8]

Finding it difficult to proceed with litigation?

Not everyone here believes a fruad has been committed.

[nswst8]

yeah im with homie on this. if you guys are so comfortable waiting, buy my spot from me. i want my money back. OR. COMMUNICATION!

but yes, if you have the phone #, please please please PM it to me.

i'm going to call and very politely ask what is going on, even if i have to leave a message with my phone number, its okay. because if my call is never returned, i know where they stand. it will be clear.

again, THEIR problems, are not MY problems, therefore, they shouldnt be causing ME problems.

i want what is rightfully MINE, and if you guys dont like it, i dont really think i could care any less about it. this is a ridiculous situation. all any of us want is communication from these people, and we have nothing. they even covered their tracks by making it next to impossible to reach them. if that doesnt smell like bullshit, i dont know what does.

When you started it was about principle not money, what has changed?

I'll buy your spot for .25 cents on the dollar and give you a 120 day buy back option for a 10% fee.

[stat1K]

hey phil, you made your own thread, why not stay out of this one? if so many people don't believe a fraud has happened why are there so many posts in this one and only 2 in yours?

i'll still go back to how when wprocomp talked to innovative they said there was no group buy, yet tommy maintained in the mount thread that they were just making some changes before running the parts... wouldn't innovative have a whole bunch of sets ready for those involved? i'll stick to this detail for all the proof i need.

[nswst8]

hey phil, you made your own thread, why not stay out of this one? if so many people don't believe a fraud has happened why are there so many posts in this one and only 2 in yours?

i'll still go back to how when wprocomp talked to innovative they said there was no group buy, yet tommy maintained in the mount thread that they were just making some changes before running the parts... wouldn't innovative have a whole bunch of sets ready for those involved? i'll stick to this detail for all the proof i need.

I made him an offer to buy his spot.

It's a good thing the legal system doesn't work according to your standards.

[2oodoor]

stat1k you seem to thrive on this "misfortune " as you see it is one, zup wit dit you're cracking me up

[ghettogeddy]

When you started it was about principle not money, what has changed?

I'll buy your spot for .25 cents on the dollar and give you a 120 day buy back option for a 10% fee.

thats actualyl a good deal lol
dosent seem like alot

76 bucks plus if tommy dose come back you can buy your spot back within 3 months for 8 bucks. thats more than any of you are gona get with a lawyer


sorry i had to edit i got my numbers mixxed lol

[wprocomp]

[QUOTE=stat1K;973720}
i'll still go back to how when wprocomp talked to innovative they said there was no group buy, yet tommy maintained in the mount thread that they were just making some changes before running the parts... wouldn't innovative have a whole bunch of sets ready for those involved? i'll stick to this detail for all the proof i need.[/QUOTE]

Tim did tell me tommy was interested in buying multiple sets of mounts but he never heard back from him on how many he wanted so I do believe there was talk of getting a GB going,Tim also told me that he never told him a bulk price because tommy was not a dealer with an account and he will not release prices unless you write up a contract with them to do so.

What Tim told me in a nutshell was

1.They already had an accord from another local customer that they where working on designing mounts for before tommy ever contacted them.

2.Tommy just happened to call at the right time and they made an agreement to let innovative copy/reproduce the Place racing mounts-for allowing them to do so the original Place Racing mounts where sent back to him as well as set of the innovative mounts.

if he's lying to me I don't really know why he would or what his deal is but nobody else has yet to contact innovative so this is all we have to go on unfortunately.

We have people on both side of the fence on this and some standing right in the middle,I myself am currently in the middle hoping this will pan out and everyone gets there mounts BUT we have to prepare our-self's in case this does not in fact get resolved within a reasonable period of time-you guys have to understand this. This isn't a huge class-action lawsuit on the verge of happening,it's simply concerned buyers wanting there money or products accounted for in some way shape or form.

[nswst8]

This is the way I see it.

If I am wrong, then I am wrong. Yet I do have a recourse. Litigation. I have plenty of time to recoupe my monies invested. And yours as well. Its not an easy solution yet it is a solution that can be implimented if nessasary.

In the end, if this is the nessasary course of action, there are a number of ways to persue it. This is why I am not concerned at this point in time.

There is a trail and I have followed it, I have found what I was looking for and am perfectly satisfied in being patient at this time.

[stat1K]

I've prepared a list of concerns based on the original mount thread that i would like everyone to be aware of.

First:

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=115

In this post he clearly states pricing. Now from what Tim told wprocomp is that he never told tommy a bulk price... so where did these prices come from?

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=125

This post kind of clears up where he got a price from, if they told him a specific price the plan could have been he will pay that price times however many people, but since the other post said 275 for 50+ etc, where did he get that price?

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=136

In this post he says that Innovative wants the money in full, now if Tim said he never gave tommy prices why would he want the money in full?

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=149

This one says that it's going to be a one off run, I believe what happened was due to the poor turnout it became that they were going to produce them? But Tommy also maintained this fact for a while to get more people involved.

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=171

Here he says he didn't have a date for final payment.

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=269

On 3-11 he has pictures of the mounts from Innovative.

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=303

on 3-26 he closes the GB.

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=332

Here is where the whole september deadline came about. He says he only got 13 orders so Innovative was going to produce the mounts and keep the rights. And STARTING SEPTEMBER THEY WILL BE AVAILABLE TO EVERYONE. Now this is one of my major problems. Everyone seemed to think that meant the group buy would be done in September, but if 3geez had first run why wouldn't it be done before everyone else could purchase their mounts?

https://www.3geez.com/forum/showpost....&postcount=359

Here it is 3 months after the last post and he says he doesn't have any updates. Shortly after this he disappeared.


So if money was due in March and Innovative never gave him pricing for multiple sets yet in post 332 he states that he had to agree to a deal with innovative due to only 13 sets being able to be purchased why would Tim lie and say that he never gave Tommy pricing nor did he ever get money for multiple sets of mounts? Why also would Tommy set a deadline if this never happened. And lastly why would Tommy say that 3 months after he collected money he still had no new information regarding it?

[nswst8]

If Tim at innovative will only deal with a bonafied dealer then it is possible Tommy was trying to get things in order to supply Tim with a business licence or tax ID number.

Tommy from what I understand was an owner/operator of an audio shop which leads me to believe that Tommy was trying to get back into the game.

Again, I understand your concern. At this point it is all just speculation and allegations. If it was a scam then Tommy would have taken more money. Again the mounts are in production. Tommy was working some angle as we all do in the business.

[stat1K]

yeah except when you paid tommy for stuff from his "audio shop" on ebay it went into his fiance's paypal still... and you're not tommy, how do you know he would have taken more money?

yeah, "working an angle" sounds just like you alright.

[nswst8]

yeah except when you paid tommy for stuff from his "audio shop" on ebay it went into his fiance's paypal still... and you're not tommy, how do you know he would have taken more money?

yeah, "working an angle" sounds just like you alright.

Are we upset? Poor baby. Get over it.

I know because I offered it to him. Read the thread.

[markmdz89hatch]

ok ok, honestly minus the last mini digs, you guys have been playing nice. haha, j/k. But seriously, Phil, I see your point about them facing many obstacles with the legal avenues of getting their money back. ...but Harvey, you do seem very determined, and determination usually gets you somewhere, so I wish you luck in whatever you do.

Statik, that's awesome that you drudged your way through that thread and really pulled out the key points. I did the same thing, but didn't go so far as you did in actually posting and referencing posts in that original thread. That should definitely help out Harvey (any anyone else that wants to go his route).

wprocomp --> Tim and I have spoken a couple of times as well, and everything you posted is EXACTLY what I found out as well.

It's pure speculation, but a minor sticking point for Tommy if he was going to try and do what Phil was saying (getting established as a dealer for Innovative), is this group buy. Not because he's out of communication for whatever reason, and that's stirring things up, but because of the points that Stat1k touched on with saying one thing and come to find out, it wasn't done exactly as stated. Not saying it was terrible business (because in a business deal, some details are sometimes left out if the coordinator of a deal chooses to do so), but because those minor differences were highlighted and made known to Innovative by our inquiry's about their knowledge of a group buy. Because of that, Innovative may not want to extend that 'dealer' right to Tommy. ...but I think it will really show Tommy's dedication to this buy, and desire to make things right, if he comes and clears things up once he's back in action.

[markmdz89hatch]

on another note, I know Harvey opened the door by asking if someone wanted to buy him out if they were willing (and confident that it would work out) to wait for Tommy to make good on this, but let's keep any offers to him in PM instead of the thread.

[nswst8]

dully noted. I'm headed to Vegas.

[blazin3gen]

first of all yea i would be pist too if i hadnt got my money or my shit BUT

hearing from his fiance should let u guys know that he didnt rip u off. I dont know this dude ive never met em, but i know hes a die hard 3rd gen dude and for him to do all this work to rip u off.. i dont think so... somethin happen now dudes in jail and he cant do shit about it. Same shit coulda happen to you. btw this isnt his fiance's problem. her name isnt tommy. she obviously is tryin to help so some of u need to chill and stop that high school blame game shit. prank calling... common....

too all the GB members im pretty shure he didnt intend to rip u off shit just happened that was out of his reach.

[stat1K]

you don't understand that her paypal was used, so it is her problem. that's like if you started selling drugs but you had someone pay your brother... guess what your brother is now implicated.

and barring a mass conspiracy i couldn't be sent to jail so the same shit couldn't happen to me. now if he were hospitalized i'd have some empathy, but if he's in jail there is probably just cause and again i have to wonder why he was so eager to have people pay in advance if he was never told a price. seems to me like he picked a number, an amount of money he needed and went for it. What would you all be saying if the group buy turned out as he planned, 50+ people at 275+10 for shipping... $14250? Is that amount of money worth running away with?

the point is often times crimes are committed based on oppurtunity not the amount of money you get away with. I work in the banking industry and see branches get robbed all the time. We've had around 20+ robberies this year... wanna take a shot as to how much the average amount of money taken is? it's around 3500 dollars.