Need Input on new build!!!

[Accordtheory]

Struggle meaning i would start to get really hot and start to slip. Oil was foaming up and causing my clutch to get hot. SO i was done for the night..im like need a new clutch. but a stage 1 exedy shouldnt have done that so i changed the oil got me some HMTF and made a huge difference so much smoother and gears go in like butter. the SAE oil i put in felt like it was hard to push in...crappy not smooth. I remember i used to use also was NEO MTF......Best shit ever bro try it. Youll thank me later. Cost alot of money but its well worth it....at one time i had every fuild was neo but i dont have the hook up like i used to so im shit out of luck

http://www.upgrademotoring.com/performance/neo_oil.htm

Take this how you will, I'm not trying to start an argument here, but I just cannot imagine any way the type of fluid, or the condition of that fluid in your transmission is going to affect the operation of your clutch, causing it to slip. That is why I was asking you what you meant. The fluid would affect your ability to shift, with the clutch depressed, by altering the friction on the syncros, but when the clutch is engaged, how could the fluid affect the clutch's ability to grip? It can't.

Did you mean that the fluid was foaming up and somehow actually getting onto the surface of the clutch?

My money is on you needing a new (or better) clutch, and that you'll see that next time you go out to the track, provided it didn't have oil on it and wasn't out of adjustment.

[Rendon LX-i]

O i get you. IT just felt the tranny was over heating. clutch got glazed. and there for crappy performance. that was back in 04 thou LOL...

[Tdurr]

um actually if im not mistaken, the engine oil does touch the clutch(forgot wut part it lubes up) but it can affect how the clutch feels/engages. I remember reading/hearing it somewhere a long as time ago.

[2ndGenGuy]

um actually if im not mistaken, the engine oil does touch the clutch(forgot wut part it lubes up) but it can affect how the clutch feels/engages. I remember reading/hearing it somewhere a long as time ago.

No, definitely not. The only part of your clutch system that should have ANY lube on it should be a slight greasing of the transmission input shaft when you first install your clutch. You don't want any oil anywhere on any dry clutch. The clutch should not be lubed, it's a friction surface just like your brakes. If it gets oil on it from a main seal leak, or from an input shaft seal leak, it will slip. If it slips too much, it will overheat and glaze, and then you can only hope to drive it nice and wear off the glaze.

Wet clutch like on a motorcycle is another story I do believe. But I don't know crap about them. And of course there may be some obscure clutch system that works this way too, but none that I've ever heard of.

[Rendon LX-i]

once i drove it for awhile the glaze went away.....

[cubert]

Wet clutch like on a motorcycle is another story I do believe. But I don't know crap about them. And of course there may be some obscure clutch system that works this way too, but none that I've ever heard of.

You are 100% correct...most motorcycles have a wet clutch, which is lubed by the same oil that lubricates the crank and transmission.

[A20A1]

What








a great thread!


I'm looking forward to reading more on your build as it progresses.

[alberto]

Sorry I agree with Tomisimo h22 would be they way to go I mean if you got the cash for this then why not just do the engine change for a h22 or K20 just go monster gorage on this project do what you want to the engine befor it's in or just look for one allready fix up and just put it in and do the mod's.

[Rendon LX-i]

nope.....sticking with the a20

[bobafett]

:unamused:

i dont know about this bullshit of people suggesting you should have put in a different motor. Sounds to me like a shitty plan.

we both know if you bothered to DO a K20 or h22 swap, you would just end up spending MORE money to get it to the place you wanted it to be. and the thing about 'real' motors, is that its really easy to turbo them, and get all the stuff you need. but it sure as shit isn't cheap.

dunno about you guys, but if i were building a k20 setup, first thing to go would be those nice sexy high compression pistons for a set of lower CR goodies.

http://www.turbo-kits.com/rsx_turbo_kits.html - not exactly cheap. and thats just the basics.

or i guess you could just build a high comp NA motor, those are cheap and reliable...

[2drSE-i]

I know I'm not exactly a turbo guru by any means, but I know a little about a lot. I just wanted to add, you said you had your crank polished? Did they coat it when they were done? If not, I would seriously consider adding some sort of coating.

[Rendon LX-i]

Yes it was coated. I did it myself. BUT you have to remember this stock rebuild was done in 03/04 LOL. i think its done well for what it has done.im going all out with the new one. After seening chris's setup it gave me a push. Seening something well put together in person its great. ...

I have to a agree with chris. Why swap. your going to spend a large amount of money just getting the damn thing in. IN no means well i swap. I love the a20 power plant...

IFF i wanted a k,h,d,f, or w/e i would get a civc,lude,4g,rsx....BUt i love the fact where we have a strong bottom end. You wont find that in these newer cars. YES youll get easy power but HOW long well that power last? i seen my buddy push 250 on his stock F22 didnt last for shit. EVEN tuned. Was way to much....ME im running 10psi on a HUGE T04E and i dont see smoke...runs great. power is there. all im doing is bawapapapapapapapapa on 1,2 and part 3rd LOL. but point beening....Swap is a NO GO for me. I love a and sticking with the A. I love THAT i have to make shit work in order to get my car going...NOT just bolt and play.

Rendon............

Chris btw thanks a bunch AGAIN for that manifold. Thankyou.

[2drSE-i]

I think while you have it apart, you might as well have the crank rebalanced, oil holes chamfered, and have a great/quality coat put on. Make it a work of art.

Something that Chris said a while back has really stuck with me, helped me keep my eye on the prize. I couldn't find the quote,but I'll get as close as I can remember

"There is nothing in the world like an A20 that doesn't get all thrashy in the higher RPMs"

Basically, balance everything you can, and you will be super happy

[2ndGenGuy]

What kind of coat are you talking about putting on the crank?? I've never heard of this. They are hardened from the factory, and when you have them polished, it's just a tiny tiny bit of polishing to take out any imperfections. It shouldn't take off the hardening. You definitely don't want to do that.

[Rendon LX-i]

Well thats what your doing...Nitrate coating on crankshaft is needed in order to run high amount of boost. Its kinda like a zince for example for your rockers. same pricnable.

step one: it's not "nitrating". That's for fertilizing, such as sprinkling chicken shit on the petunia beds. The process is "nitriding" and it's not a "coating" but an infiltration on a molecular level. In ascending order of detail

[guaynabo89]

suspension and drivetrain should be pat of your build as well.

Front mounts going to break, so you'll have to go custom if we havent figures out something by then.

Going to need a new clutch as well witha good strong pressure plate for your 300+ goals.


If you can, not necessary but you could upgrade the suspension with as many poly bushings as you can find or maybe a trac bar setup (yum)

[Rendon LX-i]

Im planing to get the traction bar setup for sure....and i got a good solid front motor mount...Pretty stout thanks for 89t





Suspenion prolly the Ksports next year.....

[2ndGenGuy]

Well thats what your doing...Nitrate coating on crankshaft is needed in order to run high amount of boost. Its kinda like a zince for example for your rockers. same pricnable.

step one: it's not "nitrating". That's for fertilizing, such as sprinkling chicken shit on the petunia beds. The process is "nitriding" and it's not a "coating" but an infiltration on a molecular level. In ascending order of detail

I was under the impression that the crankshaft was already "nitrided" from the factory. That's the hardening process that they use (or a similar process which has the same result). And I was told the only reason you need that is if you have to grind the crank journals down and use oversize bearings. Grinding takes off the hardening, while polishing really doesn't...

[Rendon LX-i]

well depends how far you grind down. I was told that it was needed for high hp apps. why you ask...well the coating thats on the crank is old as shit...new is better. but it all depends on the specs of the crank.

[2ndGenGuy]

I didn't think the hardening "got old" but I suppose it's possible. I wasn't aware that you could re-harden the existing hardened steel either... Again, it's not a coating, per-se, but just a treatment done to the surface of the crankshaft to prevent wear. I think we need to look a little deeper into this subject.

[Rendon LX-i]

LOL....true....i can only remember so much. My auto tech teacher didn really explain the details....LOL so idk. yet there so many sayings so i just stick with what i was taught. i am going to do some research thou.

[2drSE-i]

I was thinking more of a Cryo treatment on the crank. Nothing wrong with the factory "hardening", i just assumed it was gone.

[AccordEpicenter]

from what i gather, the factory cranks are forged and nitrided. The hardness of the journals isnt an issue unless you have the crank ground, good clean factory journals (proper thickness and no scoring or damage) are all you need. I would reccomend against grinding a honda crank, it makes the journals thinner and possibly weakens the crank, plus removes the factory nitriding. You can have the crank journals polished as long as they are fairly pristine already, it wont remove the nitriding. If you have a crank that has already had damage from a spun bearing etc, id get another known good crank then try and fix that one.

[Rendon LX-i]

Okay. thats what i was thinking to but yet idk. thanks for explaining it alot better then i did.