Hey! New to the site and and just started racing a 89 accord. In the process of swapping out the engine as I spun a main first time out. Has anyone on here experimented with baffling the oil pan or running an accumulator?
Hey! New to the site and and just started racing a 89 accord. In the process of swapping out the engine as I spun a main first time out. Has anyone on here experimented with baffling the oil pan or running an accumulator?
Everybody who takes them out on the track spins a bearing. Same thing happened to us during a 24 Hours of Lemons race. We ran thicker oil in the second engine (20-50) and overfilled it about a quart. Still got an oil light flicker in a couple corners, but it held up for 8 solid hours of racing!
We are going to get an Accusump, or something similar for our next race, but that probably won't be until December. I think Lostforawhile has baffled his oil pan, but I don't think it's ever been track tested.
I'm also curious what will work best... Let us know what you find out! When is your next race?
youll have to search for the link but there is a company that still makes the pan baffle and the crank scraper, I would run the accusump for sure as they tend to uncover the oil pickup during hard turns, mainly left, a properly setup accusump should solve this
I found the link but it doesnt show the A20 anymore, he says if you dont see your engine,just ask, he did make them, so he can probably still make them Hond-Acura
Thanks guys.
I also found that link and have already emailed about the baffles and crank scrapers. But for now I've fabbed my own crude baffle and over filled by a quart. Just finished putting the engine back in tonight and fired right up. Races are this weekend. I'd like to run a accumulator but its a stock mini class so I'm not sure how that would fly. I might throw the idea out and see what they say or paint it flat black and stuff it under the intake against the block
The father In-law also has a 86 lude that he cooked last races. He didn't wait to baffle the pan and is only running the slightly higher oil level so we will know if it was crude baffles or the extra oil that makes it longer. Lol.
Also what else should I expect to fail on this when running so hard? I've already removed the power steering and a/c compressor. The axle seals at the differential seem to be leaking bad but for a free car turned racer I can keep adding oil until the car at least proves its worth.
Got ahold of Kevin @ crank-scrapers.com and theA-series baffles are $39. Crank scraper is $69 plus $100 for the Teflon and he's willing to modify the windage tray with a mesh to promote the oil to drain rather than bouncing off back into the crank.
Be putting a order in soon
Last edited by Bud_1080; 08-02-2013 at 09:14 AM.
Hmm that's tempting. $39 doesn't seem too bad for a baffle. Is that like a pre-cut piece that you weld into the pan? With a trap door or anything?
Honestly, if you can keep the engine from spinning a bearing, I don't think there's much else to fail. The other weak point, as with all Hondas in race conditions, is the head gasket.
Also found some interesting ideas on the DIY accumulator here: Anybody know how to do a cheap homebuilt accusump?: Grassroots Motorsports forum: Grassroots Motorsports Magazine
I'm still trying to figure out if the gravity feed accumulators are helpful or not. Seems like it would be too easy to build one. Not sure if there's an advantage to keeping it under air pressure.
I would hope your organization wouldn't care about the accumulator in there. It's not going to give you any performance advantage or anything, it's just saving your engine from destruction.
It's a precut baffle with a trap door and tabs to tack weld it to your pan. I think the home built accumulator will work just not nearly as good as the piston type size for size. I agree that an accumulator shouldn't be a problem but you know how some people will complain about anything if they arnt winning.
Thats what they do here, those A20 preludes have been doing really well in that class, escorts do well too because you can really sneak in performance on that mazda z20 dohc. A teflon additive wouldnt hurt either for starving moments. Let us know how you do with the car regardless
Ah bummer about the ball joint, but glad to hear the engine ran strong! I like the Ricky Bobby theme you've got going on there! I think we need more pics of your race car!
chedda has something cooking on those rear ball joints and Im sure i've seen adjustable rears that are made, I dont see an issue on the accumulators with the rules, I've never heard of a class that wont allow them, they dont add any kind of performance, just keep your engine oiled, i wouldnt go with a gravity feed accumulator, you dont know how well it will function under g force, a pressure accumulator forces the oil into the system immediately. I would invest in the accusump and the proper bracket to prevent the tube from being crushed, even if you trash the car it can always go in the next car
Good to see I'm not the only one linking to GRM here
Welcome to the Racing board. You've pretty much got it handled with the baffle, thicker oil, and overfill.
Those axle seals are like $15 for both sides. About half an hour for each side. Once you get good at axles on these cars, they are very quick to do. On a daily driven car, I'd be more concerned with them, but if you blow a CV joint, you might as well replace at least the seal on that side.
Lost, the local dirt track won't allow an Accusump, even though there is no performance advantage. Stupid rules are stupid.
So after fixing the ball joint yesterday racing went well..... Untill about 8th lap in the main heat.
Sounds like a broken piston. Valve train looks ok, plenty of oil coming out the front engine seal. Enging temp stayed fine all day.
What's a good weight of oil to be running in these engines under such abuse?
Last edited by Bud_1080; 08-06-2013 at 10:00 AM.
Oil viscosity should be determined using data from an oil temp gauge. If you start running into high oil temps, go up in viscosity. What are you running right now?
5w40 full synthetic.
Shell Rotella T6? Not a bad choice. Are you freshening up your engines, or just using up the junkyard's supply of A20s? I'm more inclined to think you're having issues with old, worn out engines rather than your oil.
Yup T6.
First engine was in the car so I never looked at anything. Second engine I did roll the bearings out. Ill probably throw this crank into the old block with a set of bearings. All depends how it looks when I tear it out.
It's hard to justify building a engine for how cheap we've been getting them but I think ill start building up a spare properly and see how that lasts.
Should a person be concerned with the max rpm it runs at? I'm touching the rev limiter at the end of each straight away for 5-15 seconds
One of the racers here, rjudgey, is making a claimed 200BHP with a ported head, some valve train upgrades, and a set of Weber DCOEs bored out to 45mm. He leaves his bottom end pretty much stock, save for using new Sealed Power OEM-equivalent pistons. If memory serves me well, he lets his engines run up to 7200 RPM. The valve springs should make it through a protest teardown if you ever run into it, and of course all of your basic machine work that makes more power should make it under the radar.
I ran different motors when I was circle track racing but it was a 4 cyl and I ran Valvoline VR 50 Racing Oil. It's around $8 a quart but I never had any oil related problems. Always held good oil pressure which is important when your running 8300 RPM although your probably not turning that hard good oil pressure is a must. I always tried to have around 7 pounds per 1000 RPMs. I always had a windage tray and the pickup modified to make sure it stayed in the oil when your going through the turns. Usually ran an extra quart or so of oil too to make sure the motor wasn't starving for oil. On a side note I'm running VR 50 and Lucas in my street driven A20 sedan and I haven't had any problems with it. A little thick maybe but the wrist pins don't chatter when I fire it up anymore.
Steve
Latest Poll and thread for you B20A guys:
https://www.3geez.com/forum/classic-a...ts-2013-a.html
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https://www.3geez.com/forum/project-c...x-new-car.html
Our second engine at Lemons, we ran 20W-50 cheapo oil. And that one actually lasted us and is doing well even with a 260,000 mile bottom end.
Thanks for chiming in, guys. My car doesn't ever see sustained high speed corners, not like you'd see on a track anyway. Cone chasing is a good deal easier on your car than hammering on it at the track.
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