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Thread: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks) + What's Available

  1. #1

    AZmike's Avatar
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    Post Dampers (a.k.a. shocks) + What's Available

    The damper’s main function is to stop the suspension from oscillating. They work in both the compression (bump) stroke and rebound (extension) stroke. Compression damping effectively adds to the springs rate, reducing how much the suspension compresses for a given bump. Higher compression settings make the ride noticeably rougher. Rebound damping dissipates the energy stored in the compressed spring, preventing the wheel from being pushed back so fast that the car continues to bounce after the bump.

    Springs that are stiffer than stock require dampers that are stronger than stock. Switching the springs and leaving the old worn out dampers or simply replacing them with OEM equivalents will leave you with a bouncy, floaty ride. If you don’t have enough money for good shocks and springs and you want to improve how your car handles, just get quality dampers—they make a bigger difference. Just swapping springs will lower the car, but it will be so unsettled through anything but smooth, constant radius corners that you lose much of the handling benefit of the stiffer, shorter springs.


    Shock v. Struts

    Third generation Accords do not have struts. Strut suspension (MacPherson strut) uses only a lower control arm, a toe link (rear) or steering link (front), and the strut to locate and support the suspension. Our cars use upper control arms to locate the suspension and coilover shocks to support the car. The springs surround the shocks so it is a coilover configuration—coilover doesn’t mean threaded and adjustable.


    Damper options for the third generation Accord:

    Koni Specials
    no longer made, but sometimes available used
    Good for springs up to about 350 lb/in without revalving
    Rebound adjustable; can be converted to external adjustable or rebuilt

    Bilstien HD
    Quality OEM replacements as purchased (not for use with stiffer springs without revalve)
    Can be revalved with specified compression and rebound settings; instructions below
    Non adjustable

    Tokico
    About 10% stiffer than stock
    Many users with stiffer springs notice bounce, especially in the front

    KYB GR-2
    About 10% stiffer than stock according to KYB
    Generally considered an OEM replacement

    Everything else available is an OEM replacement.


    Lowering much more than about 2” puts your shocks at the risk of being bottomed out frequently depending on the condition of your bumpstops. Shocks are designed to stop oscillation, not support the car. Bottoming them out can quickly destroy them. This damage is typically not covered under any warranty.


    How to get Bilsteins revalved (from Jim):

    If you purchase the shocks from www.shox.com, ask to speak to Darrell. Tell him you want Bilstein HD shocks for the 86-89 accord part numbers are B36-1135, B36-1136, and for the rears you'll need 2 B36-1089. Tell Darrell that you want them revalved by Bilstien and that you have the specs that Jack French at Bilstein needs. 100 for compression and 300 for rebound works well for H&R/Neuspeed. Stiffer springs willl probably work better with higher settings around 110 and 340. Factory Bilstein specs are 46 compression, 195 rebound. Speak with Jack French at Bilstein (1-800-537-1085) if you're unsure about what settings are likely to work well for you.

    The price will be:
    the cost of the shocks ~$370
    the shipping to Bilstein
    the revalve fee is $65 per shock $260
    return shipping charges from Bilstein to you

    If anyone already has the shocks or if they buy them off another vendor like eshocks.com you can send them to Bilstein yourself:
    Krupp Bilstein of America
    14102 Stowe Dr.
    Poway, Ca 92064
    Attn: Jack French

    They will only work on your parts if you pay the revalve fee in advance or use a credit card. Turnaround time is about a month.


    If you have anything to add or any questions post them below and I'll make changes as required.
    Last edited by AZmike; 12-06-2005 at 01:59 PM.



  2. #2
    3Geez Veteran smufguy's Avatar
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    Re: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks)

    also the KYB GR-2 shocks are available for the 86-88 accords. They are just like the Tokikos, they are only slightly stiffer than stocks and usually go well with Eibach 1" drop springs.

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    Re: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks)

    KYB GR2 are 15% stiffer than stock, and realy good quality ( made in japan).
    Many friends of me use them and they don't bounce at all ( with 35mm H&R springs) in crap Greek roads.
    We had try and Bilstein-Eibach combination and is realy bad handling......
    worst that stock at least in Greek roads. Also bilstein worn out very quickly...............the only good thing is that you can revalved them or serviced them to come back in original specs.
    Last edited by Lok; 12-02-2005 at 07:52 AM.
    ACCORD 3G RUNS FOR EVER

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    Re: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks)

    Mike, I have to disagree on your recommendations regarding revalved Bilsteins in combo with Eibach Pro-Kits (1" drop). I did install the Eibach/Bilstein 300/100 revalve, and my car still had some bounce, which was aggravating because of the money involved, even though it was close. I had another pair of Bilsteins, which I sent back to the factory and had Jack French revalve to 340/110. This I think is the ideal combo; the suspension compresses, and returns to even with no overbounce. There is no harshness either. To me, it's just right. I think this is the ideal Eibach 1"/Bilstein setup.

    Also, Bilstein is now charging $65 each to revalve, not $55.

    I do have the 300/100 Bilsteins sitting in my basement. I put them up for sale here, but no interest. Guess I'll put them on eBay. They're virtually brand new....I only had them on the car long enough to send off the other set to Bilstein for revalving.

    Thanks for your work here.

    Hal

  5. #5

    AZmike's Avatar
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    Re: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks)

    Thanks for the feedback. I've made a few revisions. I'll try to get in touch with KYB and get a definite answer.
    Mike

  6. #6

    AZmike's Avatar
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    Re: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks)

    Here's the entire response that I got from Troy Horn (troy@kyb.com):

    The GR-2 line is 10 to 15% firmer than oem product
    Mike

  7. #7
    LX User cardoc33's Avatar
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    Re: Dampers (a.k.a. shocks)

    Very interesting. Just enough stiffer to feel a difference when replacing your tired old shocks. Nowhere near the performance levels we would like, thou.
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    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Well it's true, we can now touch a better world for our cars!!! Just came back from a carshow and get out of there with a sponsor for my hatch. I'll be the first to get a custom suspension made for my car from this company.

    I've spoke with 'em almost an hour telling 'em that into 86-89 accord, choice of good suspension was a hell. Told him I needed some great shock to be able to ride a coil-over on my hatch, being able drop as i wanted into show.

    Well He told me they was able to do custom suspension for me from my OEM shock. I was like WTF? What will be the price of hell? Well, this is not the case. Will cost me a real decent price to get a full coil-over kit from the OEM suspension. Not just a damn sleeve over the shock. A REAL kit and i choose the preset of the shock myself. If they're not as good as i want? just go back and they will readjust the shock to a new preset into 48hours.

    Ok, this is in Canada. Quebec. Montreal. They are willing to produce as much kit as I want. So, I asked him price for all of you. He told me the price will play around 150$CDN per shock. Shock will be custom and they are around 40% superior in damping.

    Now, I am testing water with you all.

    Here is the details about the shock.

    About the Company:
    They are the only hi-performance shock absorber manufacture in Canada to offer selective and custom damping pressures and is also the only manufacture to offer repairs for all brand names suspension manufactures in the market.

    Due to the high demand of our customers for reinforced shock absorbers, the companie as engineered a unique technology that allows car owners and racing enthusiastic to adapt the desire damping pressure for his own car or race type.

    As a manufacture of high performance shock absorbers since 1960 we have gain the know how from drivers in Europe, Spain, Latin America and now in Canada.
    As for the choice of shock:

    RANGE SR-40
    • Sensi-road technology
    • 40% superior damping
    • Bi-tube system
    • Double action

    RANGE TR-60
    • Semi-competition valving
    • 60% superior damping
    • Bi-tube system
    • Double action

    RANGE CR-80
    • Racing valving
    • 80% superior damping
    • Bi-tube system
    • Double action

    CSA RANGE
    Custom shock absorber
    • Your choice of piston rod
    • Lowering piston rod
    • Your choice of damping
    • Repairs of all brand names
    • Choice of color
    • Oil and gas change
    • Manufacturing with your specs etc…
    So here it is. Let me know what you are thinking.

    Modo/Admin, Is This Thread in the right section? I wasn't sure if it was here or into the "To Sell" section.

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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  9. #9

    carotman's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Well, that would be the correct section. However, can they make externaly adjustable shocks(damping and rebound)? It's great to have a nice selection of shocks but it sucks if you have to remove everything and send them back because it was a little too stiff or too smooth.

  10. #10
    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    for the moment, they do not to external adjustement, but it will come in a few weeks/months they told me.

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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    3Geez Veteran smufguy's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Sounds very interesting. I would like to know more about this company and more details of their current products available and their reviews by current owners. Awsome on getting a sponsor and hopefully this would and could expand our aftermarket support in the years to come and possibly at affordable prices.

  12. #12

    Hash_man_Se_i's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Very interesting... congrats on getting a sponsorship... but what company is this?. I'm going to keep my eye on this as I'm very interested to see the outcome.

  13. #13

    AZmike's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Please keep us up to date. Statements like "40% superior damping" aren't very encouraging though.
    Mike

  14. #14
    Accord of the Year - 2007

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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    awsome find, this sounds good. I might pick up the kit for the rear.
    -My Car thread


    Shop manual <----Click here to get the 1989 Accord shop manual (clicking this will start the download of a 32meg PDF)

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    3Geez Veteran MessyHonda's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by AZmike
    Please keep us up to date. Statements like "40% superior damping" aren't very encouraging though.
    hey its better than the tokicos that we can get online...tokicos are like 10-15% more stiff....40% would be good even with 2.25 inch drop springs.

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  16. #16
    Accord of the Year - 2006

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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    sounds good great to see someone is opening doors for us.

    If anyone is interested in another route Tein has a program where you send in your stock suspension and they make it into whatever you want. Supposed to be priced similar to their off the shelf items

  17. #17
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by guaynabo89
    sounds good great to see someone is opening doors for us.
    If anyone is interested in another route Tein has a program where you send in your stock suspension and they make it into whatever you want. Supposed to be priced similar to their off the shelf items

    That what I plan on doing I wish I could find a dealer around here to handle it is the problem.



    wp

  18. #18
    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by guaynabo89
    sounds good great to see someone is opening doors for us.
    If anyone is interested in another route Tein has a program where you send in your stock suspension and they make it into whatever you want. Supposed to be priced similar to their off the shelf items
    Well this is the same as me. Difference, is they are real close of me and i can be the reseller for all of you if you want some. I won't take a penny of this. You'll pay the exact price i'll get.

    I'll post more info real soon.

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by L3G10N
    Well this is the same as me. Difference, is they are real close of me and i can be the reseller for all of you if you want some. I won't take a penny of this. You'll pay the exact price i'll get.
    I'll post more info real soon.
    Im interested in the spring rates they can offer etc more than anything. I have some numbers in my head based on other like cars like Acuras.




    wp

  20. #20

    AZmike's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by MessyHonda
    hey its better than the tokicos that we can get online...tokicos are like 10-15% more stiff....40% would be good even with 2.25 inch drop springs.
    Ok, let's assume "40% superior damping" means 40% more damping than stock. Does that mean compresion or rebound damping? Low-speed or high-speed? Hopefully "40% superior damping" is just a general statement used for advertising and the numerical value is more for differentiating their products than anything else.
    Mike

  21. #21
    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by AZmike
    Ok, let's assume "40% superior damping" means 40% more damping than stock. Does that mean compresion or rebound damping? Low-speed or high-speed? Hopefully "40% superior damping" is just a general statement used for advertising and the numerical value is more for differentiating their products than anything else.
    40% more is for both compresion and rebound. I've sent all question directly to the guy who's responsible of my sponsor. More than 40% is for real racer. Not for street.

    He started to work on my full body coil over kit AND he started producing a "sample" of the 40% kit for accord 86-89. Now I need someone to try it and give us comments.

    I tought about carotman but i think his baby will sleep real soon....

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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  22. #22
    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    oh yeah, another point, We will have option to get 'em externaly adjustable but only for the damping. Door's not closed about rebound but for the moment, this is not an option for us.

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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  23. #23
    Accord of the Year - 2007

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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    Quote Originally Posted by L3G10N
    40% more is for both compresion and rebound. I've sent all question directly to the guy who's responsible of my sponsor. More than 40% is for real racer. Not for street.
    He started to work on my full body coil over kit AND he started producing a "sample" of the 40% kit for accord 86-89. Now I need someone to try it and give us comments.
    I tought about carotman but i think his baby will sleep real soon....

    That is awesome man, I really need better rear suspension. I could test it out . Seriously if he will sell it to me at cost I will be a "guinni (spelling) pig"
    -My Car thread


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  24. #24
    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    as for now, is producing a FULL kit, i mean 4 shock since our big problem was the front. The kit will be mine soon to try. I need to bring it back after to tell him impression and comments to perfect the shock. He want to produce the best he can. But as I told, my car isn't running. So someone else need to try it out for me. And not just the rear. And i Need someone I can trust since the kit need to come back after and he need constant feedback to correct the kit.

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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  25. #25
    LXi User L3G10N's Avatar
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    Re: New Option for 3rd gen Shock!!!!!

    as for the production, we will do it by group. More we will be in one shot, less they will cost us!

    My Baby; Honda Accord 86 S, B20A JDM
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