Who has the highest hp NA A20a3?

[phillie]

I'm talking about street driven. I don't want to hear just go turbo or do an engine swap. I know I can get the power that way but I want to go with the stock block. I've had turbo'd and supercharged cars all my life. I'd like to it NA this time around.

I know it sounds over the top but I'm looking for 250rwhp. I have a NOS set up laying around but I rather not use it. No FI because I'd like something reliable and dont want to worry about the heat. All that money I could put into turbo parts I want to put into the engine. Old school car and old school power.

[Joay]

I'm looking for 250rwhp.

...Well, if that's the case, the engine is the least of your worries.

[rjudgey]

Probably me

[rjudgey]

Depends which engine you use though personally i favour the ET1 but for all out horsepower the A20 is probably the better head. You'd have to spend a serious amount of money on headwork , block would be the easy and cheap bit Eagle titanium rods, titanium wrist pins, custom made oversized forged pistons with narrower rings, with high CR ratio you'd be looking at 11.5-12:1 CR ratio at least and using top quality petrol, blueprinted and balanced block. That's the easy bit then onto the head.

You'd have to have the ports welded up so that the injection housings are removed, the area around the guide and ramp welded and reshaped to remove the terrible gap around the guide, new custom bronze guides with hand shaped boss's, titanium valves, with waisted stems, oversize heads you'd have to be running at least 34-35mm heads on the inlets and then 37.5-38mm exhaust valve, exhaust ports reshaped and enlarged a little. Custom cam sent to Cat cams for a blank to be made for something streetable you'd be looking at 285 degrees inlet with 12.5mm lift and 295 degrees exhaust with 13mm lift. Would have a power range from about 4-9krpm would be driveable below 4k but don't expect much torque and bhp so you'd have to change gears a bit! Adjustable cam gear obviously to dial in the timing to perfection. And you'd have to find a really good exhaust place to custom make a dyno tuned Header with at least 1.75" primaries 2" secondaries and 2.5" collector and system with mandrel bends and race silencers. Then for Induction you'd have to run Race bike carbs with something like 45mm bore size or run Fuel injection with with custom ECU with Taper Bore ITB's with again around 45mm bore sizes.

Even with all that you'd be lucky to hit around 250-260bhp at the flywheel to get anymore you'd need a cam with more duration and then it will be very undriveable and even then probably won't ever reach the power your after at the wheels the only A20 to have that kind of power was a King motorsports 2nd Gen lude which had 340bhp at the fly but I'd imagine that would have help from Mugen as well as a lot of custom parts you'll never be able to get or make unless you win a million dollars then maybe.

It's just not realistic enough to get an A20 up that high it's a good engine but not that good the biggest floor is the SOHC setup which doesn't allow overlap alterations, and the angle of the inlet ports to the valves are too sharp compared to modern high HP designs. And then the biggest weakness is the crank stroke and the small size of pistons which doesn't allow bigger valves to be fitted if you look at all high powered 4 Pots that have over 300bhp they have huge pistons with huge valves to get the flow through the head.

[MessyHonda]

i remember on ebay they sold a a20 that claimed it made 320whp but with like 12:1 compression and it was carb set up

[turabaka]

...Well, if that's the case, the engine is the least of your worries.

I lolled.

[2drSE-i]

I know it sounds over the top but I'm looking for 250rwhp.

you realize the rwhp means rear wheel horsepower? anywho, its going to be impossible to street an na a20 with that high of horsepower. Your going to have to run pretty high compression, and thats just not reliable.

[snoopyloopy]

...well, if that's the case, the engine is the least of your worries.

+1

i remember on ebay they sold a a20 that claimed it made 320whp but with like 12:1 compression and it was carb set up

wasn't that one a race engine?

[lostforawhile]

um there are cams made remember? for one thing one of these performance companies was offering to do the head work, it wasn't cheap, but it's out there,can someone find the link or the thread? just get rid of the existing intake manifold period, going to have to fab something. i like the four bike carb setups, you can get decent sized bike carbs also, i don't see why it couldn't be done this is already a larger block then most honda 4's, there have been many brittish 2.0's done NA with this much horsepower over the years, and they flowed much worse then this engine. they went to a lot of trouble to get this much power out of the s2000 but thats because it has to meet so many regulations, if they had wanted to get more without having to fall within all that, i'm sure it could be done.

[lostforawhile]

here's the thread on the gude head package, not sure if they still do it, https://www.3geez.com/forum/showthread.php?t=53033
you could try to talk to johnny O, he's not running the a20 anymore so he might give up some secrets(we all hope)

[rjudgey]

Yes there are cams available but they have no where near enough lift and duration to be able to flow the air and fuel needed for 250bhp let alone 300bhp, and yes there are engines in UK and the S2000 engines but you only have to look at the port angles and the size of the valves to see how they make those big numbers! The piston size on say a Cosworth YB or XE (partly Lotus and Cosworth designed) and S2000 is huge and as a result they can run valve sizes of around 35-36mm in diameter the biggest we could hope to run is probably 33mm maybe 33.5 at a push depending on how big you go on the exhaust valve which is just as critical to increase in size. Also the shorter stroke allows for more bhp where as our long stroke has to be developed more for torque than bhp.

[phillie]

Well ill have to look into a swap or turbo. I don't want to spend more on an A20 when ill get more hp out of a b swap or turbo. I'd like to stay NA.

[bobafett]

I nominate this thread for having the best first reply ever.

The horse has already been beat, but if you think a 250rwhp a20 is going to be more reliable than a 250rwhp turbo accord you have another thing coming.

The highest RWHP accord is vector with like 120 ish i would venture. But thats not an A20 so go figure.

[labeledsk8r]

I nominate this thread for having the best first reply ever.

The horse has already been beat, but if you think a 250rwhp a20 is going to be more reliable than a 250rwhp turbo accord you have another thing coming.

The highest RWHP accord is vector with like 120 ish i would venture. But thats not an A20 so go figure.

hell he's the ONLY one with RWHP at all lol

as for WHP 250 is very unlikely out of a NA a20 setup and will be MUCH cheeper to swap and build a B to get those numbers, turbo would also be a good bet either way you need some bank, and doing this on a carb setup will make things even harder

[phillie]

My bad on the RWHP. Its been along time since I've owned a front wheel drive car. Sorry I'm just a lame ass. I'll try to remember next time.

I guess I'm asking to much for the A20. I'm used to newer cars that can make bigger hp. Shit I'm half hearted to try a D16 turbo project. I see those making 350 hp semi built.

[Joay]

My bad on the RWHP. Its been along time since I've owned a front wheel drive car. Sorry I'm just a lame ass. I'll try to remember next time.

I guess I'm asking to much for the A20. I'm used to newer cars that can make bigger hp. Shit I'm half hearted to try a D16 turbo project. I see those making 350 hp semi built.

I was just fucking with you btw.

Personally I think it would be rad to go nuts with an A20. It's possible, really, but the issue (aside form money) would be that it just wouldn't be streetable. You'd have 250whp from like 8,000 to 8,006rpm. Anywhere outside of that you'd be putting out hardly any torque and it would be a pain in the ass to drive.

It's a simple formula: get lots of air, add a ton of fuel, and compress the bejesus out of it. You might even want to read up on water/meth injection. But all that time and money for a 20-year-old Accord that you can't even drive around would be hard to swallow.

[Rendon LX-i]

I think the best i saw from me beening on here was Openloops with 170ish...thats pretty damn good with some serious mods..could go higher...wit some nos or some shit

[MessyHonda]

I think the best i saw from me beening on here was Openloops with 170ish...thats pretty damn good with some serious mods..could go higher...wit some nos or some shit

yeah 163whp....but that shit gets me 23mpg...haha

with stock headers intake and vac dizzy

[bobafett]

pretty sure rich has dominated those figures...

[Civic Accord Honda]

turboing the a is ur best bet

[phillie]

I have about $3k to spend so maybe a LS Vtec turbo.

[bobafett]

at least turboing a B-swap will be more straightforward due to having an actual aftermarket. However I would be surprised if you could do both an engine swap and a turbo setup that is not crappy with only $3k.

good luck to you, lets hear the plan...

ps turbo LS is probably a safer bet, do some research at homemadeturbo.com. ls vtec is a great motor, but from what I understand its a bit high strung in stock form (too high of compression ratio).

LS motor is probably cheaper too than finding the b16 head in addition to the motor, unless you find a prebuilt LSVtec.

(ps) i dont know a ton about B-series, but that is my overall impression that I have gathered.

[bobafett]

at least turboing a B-swap will be more straightforward due to having an actual aftermarket. However I would be surprised if you could do both an engine swap and a turbo setup that is not crappy with only $3k.

good luck to you, lets hear the plan...

ps turbo LS is probably a safer bet, do some research at homemadeturbo.com. ls vtec is a great motor, but from what I understand its a bit high strung in stock form (too high of compression ratio).

LS motor is probably cheaper too than finding the b16 head in addition to the motor, unless you find a prebuilt LSVtec.

(ps) i dont know a ton about B-series, but that is my overall impression that I have gathered.

[Rendon LX-i]

The way the ls/vtec is...its kinda likea minime its a hight comp motor..with some pistons and are a lower ratio then your set...ls/vtecs are Savage setups an with turbo....tune the crap out of it and your set.

[Joay]

If you're keeping it NA then an LS/VTEC is doable for three large. That'll keep a smile on your face for a while on its own.