oil leak, could it be transmission seal for half axel?

[derolph]

I've been trying to determine the source of some leaking. For awhile, I assumed it was coming somewhere from the engine. But, the engine oil level seemed to not drop at a rate consistent with the evidence of leaking on my garage floor. Just 2 days ago, I checked to oil level in the manual transmission. It was low. I had to add about 1/2 quart to bring to the full level. I had just changed the oil in the transmission last fall and my average weekly miles driven had been low. So, the transmission should not have been 1/2 qt. low.

Also, the side of the transmission, the area around the half axel, is wet with oil. Does the transmission have a replaceable seal where the half axel connects to it?

[derolph]

This seems to be the part I have in mind: Beck/Arnley Drive Axle Flange Seal 052-3545

Am I right?

[niles]

This seems to be the part I have in mind: Beck/Arnley Drive Axle Flange Seal 052-3545

Am I right?

From the looks of it that is the Passenger side. I had to replace mine for leaking, but I have auto (easier to troubleshoot with red fluid lol). The seal might be the same for both.

[Oldblueaccord]

This seems to be the part I have in mind: Beck/Arnley Drive Axle Flange Seal 052-3545

Am I right?

That's the drivers side. but I have been wanting that one for a while and can't quite get the correct one for some reason. The passenger side has more distance between the seal and the outside edge for some reason. At least on my car. I got the passenger side pretty easy I think from Advanced.

[derolph]

That's the drivers side. but I have been wanting that one for a while and can't quite get the correct one for some reason. The passenger side has more distance between the seal and the outside edge for some reason. At least on my car. I got the passenger side pretty easy I think from Advanced.

So, "right" is the driver's side? I thought it meant the passenger side.

I am close to concluding I need to have a repair shop do this. I was hoping to do it to save money but I have not been able to break the lock nut on the half axle loose. And, the whole procedure looks like a challenge. I'm often up to challenges but we all have our limits, don't we?

I got an estimate from one shop and I thought it was high; they factored in 2 hours labor. I quizzed him a bit about the labor time. He said he was assuming they might have difficulty getting certain bolts removed; sometimes, seizing makes it difficult. He added that if no particular problems were encountered during removal of the half axle, he would lower the labor time to 1 1/2 hour. In other words, the 2 hour labor estimate was allowing for a worst-case scenario.

I contacted another shop and their estimate was based on 1 1/2 hours labor.

I have dealt with both shops in the past. If I have one of them do it, I'll probably go to the second one mentioned, even though their location is not as convenient. Part cost was about the same with both shops.

I just had a new thought. Perhaps I could ask a shop (could be different shop than either of the two mentioned above) to break loose the axle locknut for a small fee.

Also, I have been wondering whether the seal could be replaced without removing the locknut and without removing the axle from the wheel hub. In other words, if the right bolts are removed, could the whole assembly (wheel hub and axle) be pulled out/outward enough to pull the axle out of the transaxle, and remove the old seal and install the new one?

[derolph]

Well, I did get the locknut broke loose by a shop (not one of the ones I got an estimate from); the guy didn't charge me for this. So, I guess I'll be proceeding with this DIY project.

[Oldblueaccord]

Well I have advanced auto here to and I don't think they can get what we want right left up or down.



That's my driver side seal.

As far as pulling everything away to do it I don't think you can. If our cars where macperson stut I think you can do it this way but im not a line mechanic.

[HLW]

Well I have advanced auto here to and I don't think they can get what we want right left up or down.



That's my driver side seal.

As far as pulling everything away to do it I don't think you can. If our cars where macperson stut I think you can do it this way but im not a line mechanic.

You can do it without removing the axle nut. You have to remove the caliper and hang it from the spring with some wire. Then disconnect the tie rod end from the steering knuckle. Then pop the upper and lower ball joints loose and use a pry-bar or screwdriver to disengage the axle from the diff and you can remove the axle and steering knuckle together.

Of course it is easier to just use a 1/2 inch breaker bar and a 32mm impact socket with the car on the ground to break lose the axle nut because if you have to, you can stand on the end of the breaker bar. When you do that, you need to use punches and/or screwdrivers to bend the part of the nut that was bent to lock the nut in place back so the nut is not locked to the axle.

[Oldblueaccord]

You can do it without removing the axle nut. You have to remove the caliper and hang it from the spring with some wire. Then disconnect the tie rod end from the steering knuckle. Then pop the upper and lower ball joints loose and use a pry-bar or screwdriver to disengage the axle from the diff and you can remove the axle and steering knuckle together.

Of course it is easier to just use a 1/2 inch breaker bar and a 32mm impact socket with the car on the ground to break lose the axle nut because if you have to, you can stand on the end of the breaker bar. When you do that, you need to use punches and/or screwdrivers to bend the part of the nut that was bent to lock the nut in place back so the nut is not locked to the axle.

HLW thats good to know for people that cant get that giant nut loose.

Here my passenger side manual trans seal I just changed 2 days ago.



Beck/Arnley Drive Axle Flange Seal 052-3480: Get the best Transmission Seals And O-rings at Advance Auto Parts

pretty sure this as it.

[derolph]

You can do it without removing the axle nut. You have to remove the caliper and hang it from the spring with some wire. Then disconnect the tie rod end from the steering knuckle. Then pop the upper and lower ball joints loose and use a pry-bar or screwdriver to disengage the axle from the diff and you can remove the axle and steering knuckle together.

Of course it is easier to just use a 1/2 inch breaker bar and a 32mm impact socket with the car on the ground to break lose the axle nut because if you have to, you can stand on the end of the breaker bar. When you do that, you need to use punches and/or screwdrivers to bend the part of the nut that was bent to lock the nut in place back so the nut is not locked to the axle.

Thanks, that's good to know. As I mentioned, I did get the locknut loose with some free help from a repair shop owner. Before that, I did try standing on the end of a breaker bar but still could not get it loose. At this point, I'll probably follow the usual procedure since I can now remove the locknut.

By the way, I also discovered the locknut was never locked in place by bending the rim into the notch on the axle, as it should have been. I now realize the shop that replaced that CV axle did not properly finish the job with regard to the axle nut.

Here my passenger side manual trans seal I just changed 2 days ago.

Did you replace it to stop a leak?

[Oldblueaccord]

Thanks, that's good to know. As I mentioned, I did get the lock nut loose with some free help from a repair shop owner. Before that, I did try standing on the end of a breaker bar but still could not get it loose. At this point, I'll probably follow the usual procedure since I can now remove the lock nut.

By the way, I also discovered the lock nut was never locked in place by bending the rim into the notch on the axle, as it should have been. I now realize the shop that replaced that CV axle did not properly finish the job with regard to the axle nut.

Did you replace it to stop a leak?

No I just wanted to change it while I'm putting in a new clutch.... its turning into more like a 300k mile over haul on my car. I do think the drivers side might leak but I don't have one to change out. I ran thru some part numbers and I think there is confusion between the auto and manual box.

The lock nut usually stays put once torqued to 134 ftlbs but bending the tab insures it.

[HLW]

By the way, I also discovered the locknut was never locked in place by bending the rim into the notch on the axle, as it should have been. I now realize the shop that replaced that CV axle did not properly finish the job with regard to the axle nut.

With a 1/2 inch breaker bar usually about 18 inches long, when you stand on the end of it, you are putting about 1.5x your weight in pound feet of torque on the nut. Unless you weigh less than 100 pounds, that will be enough because the nut should be torqued to 134 pound-feet. It seems that the last person to put the lock nut on used an impact wrench and overtightened the nut. That could have damaged the threads on the axle or the nut. The nut would be more likely to have its threads damaged to stripped though.

[gyates93]

With a 1/2 inch breaker bar usually about 18 inches long, when you stand on the end of it, you are putting about 1.5x your weight in pound feet of torque on the nut. Unless you weigh less than 100 pounds, that will be enough because the nut should be torqued to 134 pound-feet. It seems that the last person to put the lock nut on used an impact wrench and overtightened the nut. That could have damaged the threads on the axle or the nut. The nut would be more likely to have its threads damaged to stripped though.

Unfortunately torque to remove a nut is not always this simple, you're not allowing for any corrosion at all, flexing in the tools, etc..

Chances are it WAS over tightened, but it's likely that he problem really was corrosion. You're right, there aren't many nuts you can't get off with a good breaker bar. 3/4 inch drive next time!!!

[derolph]

With a 1/2 inch breaker bar usually about 18 inches long, when you stand on the end of it, you are putting about 1.5x your weight in pound feet of torque on the nut.

I tried that technique and will still not able to loosen the nut. Then, I got help breaking it loose from the repair shop mentioned in my previous post. So, like gyates93 said, it's not always that simple.

[Oldblueaccord]

Any luck on the seals?

[derolph]

Any luck on the seals?

Well, I have not replaced any seals yet. I was thinking the right one needed to be replaced but further observation seemed to indicate it was not the culprit and I need to continue observation. So, I haven't replaced any seals yet. I also concluded, with regard to the right seal I was thinking needed replacing, that I could not do that job myself. I started to explore removal of the CV axle on that side and realized I was going to have a major challenge trying to get the large bolt that holds the bottom of the wishbone off. I believe "seized" is definitely the right word to describe it. But, again, I realized that the main leak problem is elsewhere.

[HLW]

Unfortunately torque to remove a nut is not always this simple, you're not allowing for any corrosion at all, flexing in the tools, etc..

Chances are it WAS over tightened, but it's likely that he problem really was corrosion. You're right, there aren't many nuts you can't get off with a good breaker bar. 3/4 inch drive next time!!!

With the axle begin steel and the nut being brass, the threads on the nut conform to the threads on the axle enough to keep water from getting in enough to cause corrosion on the threads, so the only areas you will get enough corrosion to make a difference is where it will not make a difference to breaking the nut loose. Also the break away torque is less than the tightening torque.

The loss form the breaker bar flexing is not enough to require more than 100 pounds at 18 inches as long as the nut is unstaked and was properly torqued. The nut on Derolph's car was most likely torqued with an air impact wrench to around 200 or 250 foot-pounds.

[HLW]

I tried that technique and will still not able to loosen the nut. Then, I got help breaking it loose from the repair shop mentioned in my previous post. So, like gyates93 said, it's not always that simple.

Your nut was most likely over-tightened by the person that put it on using a torque wrench, 100 pounds of force at 18 inches is enough to break loose an un0staked and properly torqued axle nut on our cars.

[Oldblueaccord]

Your nut was most likely over-tightened by the person that put it on using a torque wrench, 100 pounds of force at 18 inches is enough to break loose an un0staked and properly torqued axle nut on our cars.

Good story but in reality it doesnt always work that way.

[HLW]

Good story but in reality it doesnt always work that way.

Whatever.

It's not a story.

I understand that more force is needed sometimes, but that is due to over-tightening the nut, which is what I said before.

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk

[Dr_Snooz]

100 pounds of force at 18 inches is enough to break loose an un0staked and properly torqued axle nut on our cars.

Methinks you speak from experience here and ideally, it will work that way. Yet, sometimes the threads get boogered up or the spindle gets deformed. Sometimes the CV joint rusts to the hub and you have to beat it out with a hammer, mushing the threads just enough to matter. You aren't going to drop another $70 on a new axle if you can manage to get the spindle nut back on and up to torque. Which you always can. When you go to pull it apart again, it doesn't really matter what you do, it's an ungodly fight. You'll curse yourself at that point, but you'll feel like you cheated fate until then. I've seen it happen, and yes, I've done it.

[derolph]

You can do it without removing the axle nut. You have to remove the caliper and hang it from the spring with some wire. Then disconnect the tie rod end from the steering knuckle. Then pop the upper and lower ball joints loose and use a pry-bar or screwdriver to disengage the axle from the diff and you can remove the axle and steering knuckle together.

That is, indeed, how the mechanic did it. Only took about 15 minutes. I was standing right there in the shop when he was doing it. I was amazed.

The new seal definitely seems to have stopped a leak.